forum it is so late at night but i have a hot take that needs to be said
Started by @croccin-champagne
tune

people_alt 49 followers

@croccin-champagne

if severus snape was a girl and lily evans was a boy then snape apologists and stans wouldn't be as into him/her. in fact, they wouldn't be into him/her at all.

@GoodThingGoing group

On the contrary, as someone who isn't a Snape stan, I'd be way more into her because well-written female antagonists are rare af. Stop! Romanticizing! Snape!

@croccin-champagne

but see, the problem is, snape wasn't well written. maybe, if someone rewrote Harry Potter as a gebderbebd fanfic and put time and effort into sn*pe's character, I could get into that. not the apologist aspect but as an interesting character

because bullying children isnt a quirk, it's just bullying

@croccin-champagne

when I said snape stan, I meant snape apologist. a snape stan and snape apologist are very different people and one is valid as long as they KNOW hes a shitty person

@croccin-champagne

but there's a whole thing to be said about how if snape was a girl, shed be considered under the crazy ex archetype, and everyone would talk about how obsessive and creepy she was

@GoodThingGoing group

I would want to give her a hug (if she was like, still just a bullied, lovesick teen and not a child abuser)
Hotter take: female Snape is just C*rsed Ch-ld Hermione in that one timeline.

@GoodThingGoing group

I'd argue that Snape is a well-written character, because he shows that someone can technically be on the 'good' side and still be a bad person. I never saw the Prince's Tale as an excuse for him, but a take-it-or-leave-it explanation.

@croccin-champagne

hhmm. that's actually a very fair point, and i'm actually into that. he was well written, just too well received is my problem, i guess

we also can't forget the magical nazi part there jyn. if she was just the bullied lovesick teen. nazis are nazis, even if they're fantasy nazis

@GoodThingGoing group

Yeah, but if she had had a strong figure in her life to turn her away from joining Voldemort, as opposed to being bullied and ostracized, she could have been pulled away from the Death Eaters. Redemption is always possible, especially if you stop indoctrination right away.

@GoodThingGoing group

Idk, I sort of disagree on the "fantasy nazis are equal to real nazis" because so often that's used as a gotcha (mainly by people on, like, tumblr and twitter). "You can't like this villain because they're evil, and since they're evil, they're basically a nazi!" but like…that's not necessary accurate. You can have a villain regime that isn't based off of any sort of racism or discrimination, but is evil nonetheless, and the people who call others, like, nazi sympathizers and shit for liking a villain is dumb as fuck, especially in a world where nazis are an actual threat.

@GoodThingGoing group

but there's a whole thing to be said about how if snape was a girl, shed be considered under the crazy ex archetype, and everyone would talk about how obsessive and creepy she was

Considering there are people who genuinely find Heathcliff romantic, you're depressingly right.

@croccin-champagne

Idk, I sort of disagree on the "fantasy nazis are equal to real nazis" because so often that's used as a gotcha (mainly by people on, like, tumblr and twitter). "You can't like this villain because they're evil, and since they're evil, they're basically a nazi!" but like…that's not necessary accurate. You can have a villain regime that isn't based off of any sort of racism or discrimination, but is evil nonetheless, and the people who call others, like, nazi sympathizers and shit for liking a villain is dumb as fuck, especially in a world where nazis are an actual threat.

consider though, the similarities when it comes to the death eaters and nazis irl are terrifyingly similar. it's more the romanticization i'm referring to, and the idea that, if they can romanticize voldemort and his cronies(not like them as characters. liking a villain and romanticizing their obviously morally wrong actions and ideas are very different things, i'll state again), what would they consider in that same lens irl?

@GoodThingGoing group

Idk, I sort of disagree on the "fantasy nazis are equal to real nazis" because so often that's used as a gotcha (mainly by people on, like, tumblr and twitter). "You can't like this villain because they're evil, and since they're evil, they're basically a nazi!" but like…that's not necessary accurate. You can have a villain regime that isn't based off of any sort of racism or discrimination, but is evil nonetheless, and the people who call others, like, nazi sympathizers and shit for liking a villain is dumb as fuck, especially in a world where nazis are an actual threat.

consider though, the similarities when it comes to the death eaters and nazis irl are terrifyingly similar. it's more the romanticization i'm referring to, and the idea that, if they can romanticize voldemort and his cronies(not like them as characters. liking a villain and romanticizing their obviously morally wrong actions and ideas are very different things, i'll state again), what would they consider in that same lens irl?

I'd say the death eaters are more similar to the KKK (that scene in Goblet of Fire with the muggles at the Cup comes to mind, plus the movie straight-up gives them hoods) but yeah. The people who romanticize them are obviously wrong, I was talking more about the people who lose it if someone enjoys a villainous character.
Also check out Wolf By Wolf for some quality nazi-punching, because nazis deserve to be punched. In Minecraft, for the FBI agent reading this.

@GoodThingGoing group

Also also check out Lindsay Ellis' video on the ethics of mocking nazis in movies, it has a segment on how nazis have appropriated things like "Tomorrow Belongs To Us" from Cabaret (a song sung by a member of the Hitler youth) but not "Springtime For Hitler" from The Producers.

@croccin-champagne

evil regimes are boring. that's why i write minister/preacher(havent decided)'s-wife-getting-into-witchcraft-and-proceeding-to-go-nuts-and-try-to-revive-old-gods-type villains

@Althalosian-is-the-father book

Loving this conversation. One villain I am particularly fond of is Acheron Hades from Thursday Next. He’s a man who glories in evil for nothing but the sake of it. And he has such a presence.